Talk:Moctezuma II

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Moctezuma II article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Archives: 1: 3 months

Moctezuma II was a good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There may be suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.

Article milestones
Date	Process	Result
March 30, 2008	Good article nominee	Not listed

Biography: Royalty and Nobility

	Biography portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography articles
	This article is supported by WikiProject Royalty and Nobility.

Mesoamerica (inactive)

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Mesoamerica, a project which is currently considered to be inactive.MesoamericaWikipedia:WikiProject MesoamericaTemplate:WikiProject MesoamericaMesoamerica articles

Mexico Mid‑importance

	Mexico portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Mexico, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Mexico on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.MexicoWikipedia:WikiProject MexicoTemplate:WikiProject MexicoMexico articles
Mid	This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.

Indigenous peoples of North America High‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Indigenous peoples of North America, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Native Americans, Indigenous peoples in Canada, and related indigenous peoples of North America on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Indigenous peoples of North AmericaWikipedia:WikiProject Indigenous peoples of North AmericaTemplate:WikiProject Indigenous peoples of North AmericaIndigenous peoples of North America articles
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

This article has previously been nominated to be moved. Please review the prior discussions if you are considering re-nomination.

Discussions:

No consensus, 9 July 2013, from Moctezuma II to Montezuma II, see discussion.
No consensus, 14 December 2017, from Moctezuma II to Montezuma II, see discussion.

Date of Moctezuma's death and of La Noche Triste

It seems to me hard to reconcile the date of M's death as given in this article (July 1) with the date of La Noche Triste (also July 1). Wasn't the latter some days after the former? Alpheus

right, la "noche triste" was 30 of june, 1520 . Cortez delayed to run out of the city, because he still had the hight priest has hostage, and the aztec wanted to make Cuitlahuac a Tlatoani. The aztec ofered peace in excahnge, but the resume atack as soon as cuitlahuac was made TlatoaniNanahuatzin 06:51, 3 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It's difficult to have accurate dates here. The Europeans were still using the Julian calendar, which by that time had accumulated at least 10 days of error in comparison to the solar date. That is, the summar solstice for 1520 was probably around June 11th according to Cortes' calendar. Madman 22:41, 7 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

If you take June 30th as Noche Triste, the strongest narrative from multiple sources (Diaz/Cortes) is Moctezuma was sent out to calm his people and hit with a stone/stabbed "two or three" (Diaz) days before he died. It seems to have taken him several days to die, all while fighting was happening. Diaz gives a casual "next day. Then the next day" narrative, but it suggests Moctezuma was wounded June 28th. Cortes, who also does the "Next day, next day" narrative (Letter to Charles) says he was hit in the head and died "within three days" and that he had his body taken out to his people by prisoners while still in the palace. Cortes describes at least two more days of combat before Noche Triste. Florentine Codex gives no timeline but says his body was retrieved but cursed by the people. Duran says his body was abandoned on Noche Triste and discovered in the palace later. Aguilar suggests Cortes murdered the rest of the prisoners after he died and dumped all the bodies outside the palace. Anyway, I'd put my money on June 28th and his death probably factored into them wanting to leave ASAP. It's all a mess. - Nawledge — Preceding undated comment added 18:53, 15 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Host and prisoner of the Spaniards

The article states Cortes stayed in Moctezuma's palace when both archeological and historical documents indicate they stayed in Axacayatl's palace. Some sources do say they stayed, at least for some period of time, in Moctezuma's palace. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nawledge (talk • contribs) 16:43, 15 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Wiki Education assignment: Early American History Graduate Seminar

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 29 August 2022 and 5 December 2022. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): R13A199K9 (article contribs).

— Assignment last updated by R13A199K9 (talk) 17:29, 10 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Wiki Education assignment: ARHS 3720 Aztec Art in Mexico

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 17 January 2023 and 3 May 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Jlevine13 (article contribs).

— Assignment last updated by Jlevine13 (talk) 15:39, 27 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]